I'm kinda shocked that people aren't objecting to this on the basis of an "interracial marriage" alone.

Oh wait... this is a boing boing thread...
Warp Factor 6 Mr. Sulu!

IF you know your latin names (even if you don't)
This is the best place to get your ethnobotanical seeds
http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/
Nicotiana listing
http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/SeedlistN.htm

Their catalog makes for juicy reading for anyone interested in cultivating anything more than the junk found outside of the supermarket planter.

IF you know your latin names (even if you don't)
This is the best place to get your ethnobotanical seeds
http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/
Nicotiana listing
http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/SeedlistN.htm

Their catalog makes for juicy reading for anyone interested in cultivating anything more than the junk found outside of the supermarket planter.

So nobody cares that I solved it huh?
Nicotiana persica (Nicotiana alata)

Also, If you're interested in growing your own bug spray
try cultivating some N. Rustica it's about as strong as it can get.
cultivation is simple and makes for a great source of nicotine.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotiana_rustica

What gets me is that most people are throwing out stuff without any form of reference or backup in BOTH of these threads.

there are thousands of species and assorted hybrids out there in the gardening world. What gets me is that the geek (mark) didn't have the things labeled when he got them. :) It's understandable if someone gave him seeds or he got the plants at some sort of generic home depot "flowering plant sale". those are rarely marked properly (latin names)

we know it's a member of the Solanaceae family of plants
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solanaceae
that's well established.

but exactly what species or type is still out there.
]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/45/Nicotiana_alata1By_Carl_E_Lewis.jpg/450px-Nicotiana_alata1By_Carl_E_Lewis.jpg
Nicotiana persica (Nicotiana alata) Winged Tobacco, Jasmine Tobacco
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicotiana_alata

While the leaves are different due to the harsher growing conditions than the plants pictured in the wiki (they would enjoy a bit more water and humidity in less harsh sunlight)
the flower configuration is the same as are the flower spikes
the leaves and flower production is affected by the lack of water otherwise I feel it would be a very nice match.

IF there is a nice sent to the flowers (deserving of the name) then that would help to solve the mystery and I can get my scooby snacks as a reward :)

or maybe a hug from xeni or something at the next san diego comic con?

The best bet is to post a pict of the flowers to properly identify
I've grown several species of Nicotiana (tobacco) including N. Rustica.

I'm gravitating to some member of the Solanaceae family of plants
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solanaceae

But can't ID the species. Right now I'd say that the leaves are "inedible" so hold off on doing anything more than taste for nicotine content.
We'll know more when they flower.

Wow after reading that article the I get the impression that people are selling this as a way to get high. I've never seen it marketed in that manner. I have seen it in the micrograms (interestingly enough). The truth is that while the american authorities view this as a tryptamine containing "drug" it's a legitimate use is for maintaining a man's erection... nothing more.

Not to get "high" with... even though you can get tryptamines out of MANY available products or common plants.

Stupid bozo's that are overly coddled into thinking that things are baby proof in this world try to eat this stuff????. It's a venom stupid!

Bufotoxins (Bufotenine) is well known to cause cardiac arrest when it enters the blood stream.
that is what it does... that is why the animals produce it.
dog grabs the toad... toad freaks out and squirts venom out of it's glands... dog feels weird and dies in short order.

True,.. the venom also contains 5-MEO-Tryptramine
but that has also been described as having a "elephant sit on your head" certainly not a pleasant experience for a psychoactive. What is more likely is that the heating of the Bufotenine breaks the molecule apart into another tryptamine that is more interesting and not as deadly as Bufotenine itself.
but that is for another thread....

#6 POSTED BY SANTA'S KNEE , APRIL 24, 2008 1:03 PM
Sweet baby G-bus! What the hell is wrong with these people? Did they spray stupid gas all over the Congo...?

Um,... Never underestimate your fellows "Santa".
People still believe in creationism, religions, jezbus as ghod (who came back to life after death), prayer cures for diseases, alien warfare/thetans etc..
Seems like some even believe that a boston jersey would jinks a baseball team if it was buried in their stadium.
perhaps by also causing their penis's to shrink?

AP newswire:
"BOSTON – The Boston Red Sox jersey secretly buried under the new Yankee Stadium in a failed curse attempt sold Thursday for $175,100 in a charity auction."
"Construction worker Gino Castignoli, a Red Sox fan from the Bronx, dropped the jersey in wet concrete, hoping to hex the Yankees."

http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/baseball/20080424-1035-bba-yankees-cursefoiled.html

Favorite tidbit:
"This is the Land of Lincoln. This is the Land of Lincoln "

AND Exactly what is that supposed to mean?
Rationally...
The state that existed a hundred years ago
isn't the one that this myth believing woman lives in today.

and yet she holds a position of authority while ranting and repeating a license plate slogan like it really means something.
I'm beside myself with their religious non thought.

I've got the first runs/set of quest when I was still in grrade school attending one of the early SD comic cons and I'm not so sure about the coloration of b/w ink. The wendy's art was created as for inking not full color and the palate is pushed up a bit too far from where I am with the web versions.

Personally I like it better that my imagination was left to work and bring out the life colors to the drawings.

Still EQ is a landmark series and still stands as a valid series among the new breed of comics ...

As strange as it may sound... Those elf chicks gave a young man something to dream about way back then ;)

#5 POSTED BY JAKE0748 , FEBRUARY 7, 2008 8:00 PM
There should be a google button "save this video" on the RIGHT side of the play window
IF not, then try using a fre service like
http://keepvid.com/
copy/paste the URL and it'll provide you with download links
perhaps in a few different configurations.

The illegalization and halting of research into these tools is something that can and should be prevented in the modern case of Salvia D and it's actives,

Salvia may not be as significant of a tool when compared to the classic Entheogens but it's the only legal one available for use by researchers and should be protected from negative press and used responsibly.

Bests!

Overall A very solid presentation it's certainly up to the BBC's standards of bring people up vs catering down to the lowest common dominator.
THANK YOU DAVID for posting this (hope that mark is listening).

We need more publications of solid presentations of Entheogenic research made available to the public if we're to avoid the pitfalls of the past here in the USA.
Certainly our culture needs to re-define it's concept of drugs to make use of these powerful tools and medicines.

There's so much work to do and I thank David/ boing boing for being a positive part of it with this post .

Save this one to your hard drives boy's and girls!

Sincerely,
flip~

METABARON , FEBRUARY 6, 2008 2:46 AM

THANK YOU I agree with everything you've said!
especially....

"If you are a beginner, ayahuasca -if it works- will make you VERY vulnerable and suggestible. The phenomenon descibed by Jungians as "transference" is relevant here. It will be very easy to believe the magic shaman is doing the tricks, whereas in fact the director of this movie is you."

If I may follow up on that point :
The experience for the novice is confusing and foreign
Often the individual while searching for answers and explanations will quickly latch onto those offered to them by the anyone donning the robes of mystic or authority.
The experience arises from the individual in conjunction with the plants

Hence "Choose your allies wisely"

Sorry for those that read my above text as being as "flip's a know it all"
I just want to relay information and perspectives so that people can move in a positive direction and not be mislead by shams like the one featured in the article.
There's a whole legacy pop subculture out there generated by fakers and perpetuated by bozo's that people are exposed to.

It's tough going but there's good people working changing that situation .... one thought and person at a time.
:)
peace and respects
flip~

You don't need to drink Aya or take anything else to "get in tune"
I didn't want to communicate that at all...
I don't believe I said that in my post... please re-read.

It's a tool that has powerful effects that often go far beyond what people think they want or what they're think they're after.
I'm not trying to by mystical or hype it up.
It's just that it's difficult to communicate effectively the maelstrom of effects and combat peoples notions of "Psychedelic Drugs".

Also forget "altered states" it's NOTHING like Aya or any entheogenic experience for that matter. It only serves to badly color peoples perceptions of what to expect.
The best representation within a movie is "Blueberry" or
"Renegade" in the USA domestic release on DVD.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blueberry_(film)

I think that most will clearly understand the metaphor "Heaven and Hell" referring to drinking Hausca after watching that.
It can dive straight down into your own personal hellish fears made visible and penetrating as well as the insightfully expansive. IF by some chance you think "wow that looks cool" after watching it... you're not ready. You can consume it and you'll move in the wrong directions. (imho)

and yes I FULLY AGREE lets all keep this on the "down low".
Don't hype it in any way... search out and cultivate the plants.
Aya deserves better than what I fear most will misunderstand her to be ($200 dollar donations indeed!) this bozo broadcasts for profit.

Grow your own and DO NOT BUY the quick dried fixings. Develop a relationship with the plants themselves by giving them a good home and the experience will be much more rewarding.

Thank you for reading this

Flip~

STEFFROCK , FEBRUARY 5, 2008 3:34 PM

The Yage letters are basically outdated and misleading reading if you're interested in either Aya or painting a picture of souther america.
Burroughs was really a sexually confused drug addled honosexual along with Ginsberg. He neither conveys wisdom or anything viable except for his "Doc Schindler" who was in real life the late Dr. R.E. Schultes a famous botanical researcher and author of dozens of papers on the subject of Entheobotany (Ayahausca and other medicinal plants).

You would be FAR BETTER off reading "One River" by Wade Davis
http://www.amazon.com/One-River-Wade-Davis/dp/0684834960
Not only is it richer in information but it's accurate.

Again, if you're interested... google:
Dr. R.E. Schultes
You may also buy Pharmacotheon by J. Ott
IF you can locate a copy... it's the best well grounded book you can get on the subject.
http://www.alibris.com/search/books/qwork/5095574/used/Pharmacotheon:%20Entheogenic%20Drugs,%20Their%20Plant%20Sources%20and%20History

Mark, you did it again - but at least you're getting better.

http://www.boingboing.net/2008/01/24/videos-of-people-smo.html#comments

We're all generally agreed that Aya is NOT a toy
All of these Entheogens are tools to be approached with forethought and not to be taken cavalierly by anyone.
Salvia D is nothing compared to hausca, pot or even lsd
that's not hype.

Just like any powerful tool it can help as well as hurt. Perhaps not physically (with precautions) as much as mentally it can be quite harrowing or shattering for even the experienced. I don't recommend noobs jump into tryptamines without first learning how to perform the mental gymnastics required. As well as having grown personally grounded as people and then with guidance... (just to be on the safe side)

Our western cultural perspectives towards "drugs" isn't conducive to a rewarding interaction in most cases.
Please don't take it the wrong way
Aya should be legal for responsible people to use
in a proper setting and legit motivation as a medicine.

However,
Following someone like PINBACK (Pinchbeck) or the SHAM featured in the LA Times article will only lead to empty spaces, poor taste in wardrobe or much worse.
The scene is full of self styled bozo's like that who is basically ignorant of the law or out for taking people's money.
IF I would have known that "aya shaman" was in my backyard I might have gone up there to confront his ass and beat him down for being the profiteering fraud he is.

I am of the school that the "plant teaches" it's "spirit" as allies the human guide who is just there to help direct, focus or "heal".
Robes from peru, magic stones, rattles and feathers are not required.. but theater for those tourists that want bragging rights to their new age friends.

I am thankful that the journalist did see through his facade and avoidance of direct questions. I do hope that people wise up a bit to his scheme as he's breaking several laws and the DEA would have a field day with his case (interstate transport, sales and provision of a schedule 1 etc.)

I am also thankful that Gina Piccalo also mentioned the huasca research project and the findings of J Calloway. I was one of the people attending the 96 conference when he presented his findings and increased 5HT receptors flowing self administered B-Carboline's.

It just frustrates me to such a great degree when I read marks selections pertaining to "drug culture". Where many people believe that erowid "has all the answers".
Honestly speaking... it doesn't at all... and this site has so much power to help tilt the scales in how people are presented this type of information. It can make the diference in how these do or don't get incorporated into our society effectively.

There's so many people that learn to cater to preconceived notions of shamanism in order to turn a profit that it both saddens and sickens me to see her misrepresented by those that don't have a relationship with the plant.

Here's a clue...for those that are interested:
" Choose your allies wisely" (both plant and personal).

The real people don't need to play dress up, write books or develop a following to inflate their egos'. Any idiot can take a drug and echo others words and description, while the worst mimic what they think they should look and act like... vs really be in tune.
Lastly... When you're ready... it will always come to you... naturally.

Thanks for reading this.
Flip~

#51 POSTED BY TERESA NIELSEN HAYDEN / MODERATOR
"Is Salvia divinorum really a rare plant, or was it just obscure? I've never seen a salvia species that didn't set seeds at an abundant rate."

Salvia Divinorum was one of the worlds rarest plants after it's discovery by G. Wasson in the early 1960's and up to the mid 1990's.
The species was only known to be cultivated in a single Mazatecs village on the Sierra Mazateca by a limited amount of families for generations -Most likely predating the spanish invasion over 500 years ago. Researchers have not been able to locate any wild variant of the species within it's traditionally cultivated range. Oral tradition has it that it was brought in from elsewhere and is not a native plant to the region. The species have been propagated via cloning for so long that it's become dependent upon human intervention to survive. As a cultivar, it's ability to set viable seed has been largely lost.

You continue:
"Given that in the proper circumstances it can grow into a large woody shrub, if you just keep clipping the flowers off, it would take a botanist to identify the thing."

The plant will not ever develop into a woody shrub. The stems are those of a monocot and actually hollow. The plant is prone to damping (base rot) and will often have it's tall spikes break off at the base only to fall and set new roots at the nodes up to a meter away.
This is the method that it's spread through the tended gardens where it's been has been traditionally kept.
Furthermore, this species is distinctive enough that most people can ID at a glance if they have a basic beforehand familiarity with the plant. You need not be a botanist to ID it at all.
if you can distinguish a turnip from a carrot you'll be able to pick this plant out from within a field.

Here's my main point:
Salvia and salvinorin A/B are novel in their actions and effects. Not only is it the most potent naturally occurring psychoactive molecule known - but it's effects defy easy classification. The opportunity this plant presents to understanding the functions of the mind is a once in a lifetime event. To provoke it's illegality via reckless publication if ill begotten behavior via youtube and other sites is nothing short of a travesty imnsho

Such broadcasting will only stir a kneejerk backlash from legislators as has happened in other states where it's made the news.

This isn't about getting high or keeping a tripping stash legal for me or others... as some might think.

This is about having a legal tool open to investigation that offers the possibility to enrich ourselves and broaden our knowledge base.
By playing into the "it doesn't matter if they illegalize it.. I'll still buy it" argument, you're ignoring the door that is shut on all legitimate research and discovery as to the inner workings of the mind.
Please think about that... all other viable and unique tools are illegal in much of the world and therefore bared from scientific research.

Furthermore,
Just imagine for moment how responsible use of such a plant might change the whole of society for the better.
The ability to shake people out of old ruts and habits and to view the world from a new perspective.. if just for a moment would allow a society to potentially develop by leaps and bounds in comparison to the snails pace we currently are limited too.
The traditional use of this plant is best defined as a "religious tool" it's use is not recreational as it is portrayed on the net.
It's a serious affair.

That in itself is worth noting.

Thank you for reading this.
flip~

Mark, for all your technical brilliance
You REALLY ARE DUMB when it comes to the subjects of Entheogens and the power you have to misrepresent them to the rest of the world via the net.
I've had to bear the frustration of your posting of various hyped toad licking and micrograms links. Presented to a public that should be educated and guided as much as any hack that can have serious Legal, Social or Personal life altering implications!

Sir, the power of Entheogens isn't something to be taken cavalierly.

Salvia D. is a once extremely rare plant that has (via greed and profiteering) made it's way into the public forum. Mind you, Not as a living plant able of reproducing itself but only as a highly concentrated extract capable of producing effects that can be both uncontrollable and beyond the coping skill of ""pedestrian and their expectations " that these amateurish videos endorse. Your posing of the youtube video links is NOHING but counterproductive... in the efforts to educate and guide people to conducive and proper use of these and other tools. These videos are literally the blind misleading the youtube blind!

I do not know if you believe that they're just funny or what. But I can tell you with absolute certainty that both they and yourself will serve to further the efforts to demonize and illegalize both a rare plant and class of pharmaceuticals that holds the potential for both mapping and investigating the human psyche in ways that are unavailable to modern science.

I've had plants since the early 90's and let me tell you it's worthy of respect.

IF you wish I will happily write an entertaining and Informative essay for boing boing that will place this plant within a proper context for your readers that is not "preachy" nor will not stoop to plugging extracts that will only lead to misuse and eventual illegality.

Thank You.
-flip.