Whoah, freaky.

Not quite sure what I think.

-abs

Oh baloney.

Zealoutry doesn't kill people any more than Science, Religion, Guns, or Swords kill people.

All those are merely tools or causes.

[b]PEOPLE[/b] kill people.

-abs

@Robotech_Master

Oooooh. BOOOOOO!!!!!!

*throws rotten tomatoes and other vegetables in the only time-honored way of expressing the horror at a bad pun that he can think of*

-abs

Hrmmm, "Patents are Evil".

Wow, what's next?

"Water is Wet!"
"Grass is Green!"
"Winter is Cold!!!"

*yawn*

Film at eleven is I believe the next traditional statement I'm supposed to make.

-abs
"Encouraging innovation my ass."

Mmmmm.

Jessica Rabbit, one of my earlier crushes. And damn if she isn't as hot rendered as she was in the original form.

Excuse me, I need to go . .. umm, be alone for a bit.

*wanders of too look for a box of tissues*

-abs

You're not nuts. There are major problems in the US today. The "war" in Iraq is one, but not the only one, and from my perspective not the important one either. (Personally I'm more concerned about the abridgement of civil rights.)

What you are doing however is overestimating the amount of power anyone in America has. So long as the Rule of Law remains in force Americans have little choice about doing anything.

The only power the American people have, within the law, is that of voting the bastards out. Protests are cute and cuddly and all, but they have no force within the eyes of the law. All they can do is hope to convince voters that the NEXT TIME they vote they should vote better.

Beyond that the options of an average American are about nil, provided they do wish to resort to extra-legal sanctions.

And most of us Americans don't think assassinating our government officials for their actions is a really good idea. (at the moment we don't at least) Most of us think Anarchy would be worse.

(If you're Canadian you should bloody well prefer our current state to anarchy as well. If you really think about what the repercussions on Canada would be in the event of REAL anarchy in the USA you would never want it.)

I understand you're frustrated. So am I. But put the rhetoric aside and be realistic about what Americans can and can't do about their government. It won't make you less frustrated, but at least you'll sound more sane.

-abs

@ Craig in #39
"Forgive me if I say 'wake the hell up'. You and your country are doing really, really bad things. If you aren't doing anything to stop it then you are collaborating."

Whoah there cowboy. I call "Bullshit".

Collaboration requires action. French who didn't help the Nazis were NOT collaborators, they were victims. Your usage implies that everyone who wasn't a member of La Resistance was a collaborator, and that's just wrong. That term has a specific meaning, and you are misusing it badly.

If someone helps the Bushies, then they're collaborating. If someone fights them they're resisting. The rest of the people might morally repulse you because of their inaction, but they aren't collaborators.

-abs

Hi Craig,

I'm planning on doing something. I'm planning on voting. Same as I have every year. I'm also planning on pissing off my friends by talking politics at them until they get off their asses and vote too. (also the same as I do all the time)

Since the climate in the US is not currently one that would allow armed revolution I'm not on-board with anything else at the moment. When that climate changes I'll consider it.

For now I prefer the Rule of Law.

But if it gets much worse I'll have to start looking at the weather more often, so to speak.

-abs

Takuan in #11
"not to worry, the high degree of political awareness, the defiance of overbearing authority and the the extreme reluctance to resort to force of the the typical American solider will protect you from any misuse of the military against civilians."

Wow, did you know me when I was in the Navy?

I've always been cantankerous. I've always been a grand believer in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. I've always known that following illegal orders will land you in Nuremberg, and I've always believed in the Geneva Convention.

In fact that was true when I did Army basic training between my Jr. and Sr. years in high-school as well.

All that said, while many soldiers believe as I did (and do) there are plenty that don't. And with the increasing police-icization (is that a word?) of the military I suspect those of us who really took seriously the "defend the Constitution from all enemies foreign and domestic" are rapidly being outnumbered by the "because we're in charge" crowd.

I weep for my brothers and sisters. (and the rest of the nation as well)

-abs

Bwahahahahahaha!

My mom was always, "Quit playing that boardgame, and put down the sci-fi book too. Go play Outside!"

I always knew I hated that game. Now I know why.

Endless grinding, low reward levels, NO RESSURECTION! Badly implemented player-justice.

No wonder I never wanted to play "Outside". In fact, not even the new content attracts me much.

I'm gonna stick w. d20 Future and Mutants and Masterminds for now, thanks.

-abs

Oh for goodness' sake.

Kids Get Drunk!

Kids Have Sex!

Kids Horrify Their Elders!

Full story at 11!

C'mon folks. Who really gives a rat's @$$? This sort of kvetching about the youth has been going on for as long as humans have had language to use for kvetching. I recall, back in my college days, taking a course in classic Greek literatue, Aeschylus and the like, and boggling at what one writer said. To paraphrase him (badly), "The kids these days have no respect for their parents, they have no respect for the gods, they have no respect for the State, and if they continue down this road Civilization Will Collapse!"

(Of course he was right, Greek civilization DID collapse, but blame should be placed less on the youth than on Alexander's generals being pricks and the Romans being so DAMNED good at warfare.)

I call Shenanigans on the whole story. (assuming it's true at all, which considering the source, I doubt.

-abs

Awesomely cool.

Definitely what Jesus would approve of.

Also definitely NOT what modern Christian's approve of. (most of whom are more into Crime and Punishment, from my limited exposure to born-agains like my brother)

-abs

Hey GRCurley,

It's partly because some of us were beaten up in school. By making a joke of it we can defuse how we might react if we seriously thought about it.

And since I would happily drop 10 grand a piece to have two of the kids who beat me up every day in 10th grade assassinated when I let myself get worked up about stuff like that I try not to get worked up about it.

Thankfully I don't normally have 20 kilobucks laying around, and thankfully I don't usually think about my childhood at all. I suppose I should probably be grateful that my father died when I was young and that seems to have traumatized me enough that most of childhood is a blank slate, but I don't think I will since I really wish I could remember what his face looked like.

Basically, I laugh because the only two choices are laugh or cry. I'm tired of crying.

-abs

"g-emo-cide" Sweet. Wish I'd thought of that.

-abs

*laughs*

Damn Harrkev. Totally PWNED me.

Thos're some l33t flaming skillz!

I don't think I'm up to playing in such skilled company. Guess I'll just have to stick to swearing.

Ooops, let me correct that sentence.

Sht, gss 'll jst hve t fckng stck t fcked-p swrng.

(boy, I am out of practice, 20 years ago that would've just rolled off my tongue, AND it would've parsed more naturally as well too, AND I wouldn't have felt compelled to disemvowell it as well. Hrmmphhhh. I hate getting old, and civilized.)

-abs

Awesome! Emo-kids get beat up in Mexico?? Totally awesome!

Anyone know the immigration laws for Mexico? I won't have to climb over some border fence will I?

-abs (who's actually pretty non-violent in non-hypothetical situations.)

I just want to know how I can make an acceptable personal attack. I'm really not sure how I could pull that off.

I have less trouble understanding how I could use an expletive appropriately. In fact, since I was in the US Navy AND a construction worker during my life, I'd say I'm about as expert at swearing as you get. After all they don't say "swear like a sailor" or "crude as a construction worker" for nothing.

(though I'll admit that since becoming a civvie I'm not really comfortable with making "Fuck" every other word in a sentence, these days I try to keep it down to 1 in 5, maybe 1 in 6. *LOL*)

-abs

I think a fair amount of good about Harlan, unless . . . ..

1. You're in his class at Clarion.
2. You're a woman on stage with him at an award-show.

That said, both he and Niven are excellent writers, with solidly good ideas. (good in an SFnal sense) I just regret that I can't think of Niven as other than a jerk now. Not that being a jerk makes a bad, or good, writer. All it really does is make me want to avoid said jerk in 1-1 conversation.

-abs

Hey Takuan, I think Stephen Colbert advocates fairly well for that view. Richer people are BETTER people than poor, The Market says so!!!

*laughs* (Umm, a sarcastic laugh for those not getting that both me and Colbert are joking)

At the risk of offending: *refers Worlord to the Dictionary to look up the definition of "hypocrisy"* And yeah, it is pretty common in America. I do it more often than I'm happy admitting.

-abs

Hrmphhh.

Guess my opinion of Niven just went down.

If he keeps it up I'll start to class him with Harlan Ellison.

-abs

Hi Teresa!

Alas, I doubt your "education" of Worlord is likely to have any effect beyond lowering your own blood-pressure by venting what was annoying you.

Sorry, just my take on it.

More on-topic, damn I want to know why she spells it that way too. Calpurnia I could easily see. But why change the spelling in such a minor, and since it's pronounced the same, and inconsequential way? I'm stumped.

-abs

"BTW, I never got a chance to mention it at Boskone, but Damn Teresa your title for Jen's book was just about perfect. Very apropos. Hopefully you've gotten your copy by now, I know she mailed it out a bit ago."

Ewwwwww.

Giant squid???

Yigggg.

(I only like squid cooked. That thing is wayyyyyy too far from a fire for me to be comfortable with it.)

-abs

Hey Hedztalez,

I probably shouldn't be shocked at either, you're right about that. Guess I just run in a crowd progressive enough that it makes me sub-consciously forget how bad most of the nation is.

When I do that I should probably spend more time thinking about my brother. Though becoming born-again didn't make him a racist it sure did make him a homo-phobe. And Gods know there's plenty of racists out there as well, maybe even more, though I don't know any statistics.

Shocked or not, I AM disappointed.

Wouldn't trade my country for the world, literally since I'm an isolationist, but I do find myself ashamed of it on many occasions. Mostly because I feel we should be so much more than we are.

Oh well.

-abs

Ewwwwww.

Leave your dog alone in the future please.

I know I should try for tolerance but if you need a paternity test to determine who fathered your dog's puppies there's something .. . .

SERIOUSLY WRONG WITH YOU.

*laughs*

-abs

Hi Noen,

I was shocked at someone wanting to touch a black person's hair because they wanted to know if it felt like wool. I thought we were beyond that.

I wish I would be shocked at the bigotry shown to GLB/TG individuals. But given that this is America I wouldn't be. I would be horrified, and appalled (note the two "P"s indicating the level of appalled). However I wouldn't be surprised.

And yes, I'm well aware than huge sections of America view TG = Gay = Pedophile. My brother got born-again and is now in just such a section.

Doesn't mean I have to like it.

But, alas, such attitudes don't surprise me. With race I thought we'd gotten over that though. Obviously I was wrong, but I was surprised.

-abs

Yiggg. Definitely the wrong side of the Uncanny Valley for me.

I find it eerily similar to a 3D model in any number of videogames, Rome: Total War is the one that immediately comes to mind.

But turning it into a real-life sculpture definitely pushes it over the valley into the real of "That icks me out at some sub-conscious level."

-abs

LOLing at Takuan's stor in #109.

-abs

Hedztalez@102:

" even if I want to smack someone for touching my hair because "They just wanted to see if it really felt like wool." or "I've never touched a black person's hair before."

Seriously? Someone's asked you this? OMG.

Dude (used in the un-sexed sense) I'd smack someone who asked me that and I'm a white guy. You don't get more undeservedly priviledged than that.

That's totally a violation of personal space that says at least as much about the questioner's lack of manners as it does about their bigotry. (Specifically, it says "I'm a rude bigot" in ALL CAPS SHOUTING.)

The only exception might be if it was a small child, in which case exceptions should be granted along with explanations of why what they just said was rude. (well, possibly an attractive member of the sex you are attracted to might get a pass too, but only if you thought it was just a lame come-on line and not a real instance of bigotry)

I'm still shocked anyone would ask that. Ye gods. What Gaul. (because Parisi are reputed to be rude and uncouth, or so Caesar tells me in his commentaries.)

-abs

Revulsion towards something and desire for the lack of that thing are the same in my book. Heads and tails of the same coin.

Chalk the Buddha up as enlightened.

(chalk me up as not yet so)

-abs

One of my good friends, Melissa, is a member of the local Browncoats here in Boston. (The Browncoats are the fan-group interested in Firefly)

Melissa and a few other folks make hand-made trading cards, she's also into crafty stuff.

Anyhoo, her trading cards are often Firefly based in there content. Which is what initially got me aware of the hand-made trading card phenomena.

Gotta say, hand-made trading cards are cool. I think Topps here is just capitalizing on that concept. These look cool because they look less commercial, more hand-made.

(Oh, and I agree, the whole set would've been cooler if it was all sketches. That I would consider owning, the set as it is I'll pass on.)

-abs

@Takuan

Gahhh1!!!!!1!!!elves!!!

Too far! Too far!

On the other hand, I'm no longer insulin-shocky AND I'm outraged.

So maybe that anti-kitty, revulsion-chaser was in fact just about right....

*grin*

-abs

Awwwwwwwwww!

Quick, someone give me a chaser of something revolting. The cuteness is putting me in insulin shock!

-abs

Wendy's work had such a huge influence on me when I was a teenager. It had just come out about one and half years before I encountered it.

It totally changed my view on elves. A radical re-visioning of something I'd only ever considered in Tolkien-esque or mythological paradigms.

Additionally the art was cool, the story was awesome and epic, and wolves. . . . oh . . . . and the elf-chicks were hot.

-abs

*laughing furiously at Belac in #19*

(because weeping at human stupidity in the original story is the only other alternative)

-abs

I'm going to prove I'm not a parent now.

I've had many baby pictures inflicted on me over the years. In every single instance the tiny, wrinkled, often still red-skinned, little blobs of protoplasm are remarkably ugly. I've seen 89 year old women who are more attractive, while she was still alive my mother would be a good example.

Sticking them on fake movie posters doesn't make babies any less repulsive.

-abs

I agree Agent 86. It's definitely fighting the hydra.

I suggest we go with an Herculean solution, chop off Jim Prentice's head and burn the stump with a torch.

(filling his mouth with holy wafers and salt and sewing it shut before quartering his body and burying the parts, with a stake through his heart, would probably be a good idea too . . . . just in case.)

-abs

@Takuan,

Oh, I totally agree. Oil and treasure (in the form of non-bidding government contracts) are clearly the real reason we're in Iraq today.

But they're not the reason that was used to sell the war to the American public.

But we are a, regrettably, stupid people collectively. There may be smart Americans, but as a mob the American People are low-grade, easily manipulated, morons at best.

Wish I was wrong, ashamed I'm not.

-abs

I can say that as an ex-military sort myself the whole lack of value that politicians placed on our lives has something to do with my general isolationism. Congress and Presidents are far too willing to kill our men and women in uniform for reasons other than defending our nation.

Our military should defend the US. Only.

No, "let's invade some place to stop WMD." No, "let's invade to save lives." No, "let's invade to stop (or start) a civil war." No, "let's invade to further our War on Some Drugs."

Mae war only when a formal Declaration of War has been voted on by Congress, and passed. And only pass such a thing when the US has been attacked. Then bring the troops home the second we're done with the war and the concommittant reconstruction.

(yes, that does imply I approved of Afghanistan in the same way it implies I don't approve of Iraq)

-abs

[quote]I wouldn't mind non-intervention as a policy, long as we no longer hear the pieties about how much we supposedly care about human rights. Keep in mind that by making non-intervention a policy, you've just given a green light to every would-be Pol Pot on the planet. Long as they're not dumb enough to take a swing at the US, they can kill to their heart's content.

That probably doesn't sit right with you.[/quote]

Sits fine with me.

Why should I care about someone half a world away?

Tell them to keep their hands the hell off my business and I'll keep mine off theirs. Why should I care if their business is killing their own subject?

I'm not the ruler of the world, and until The World collectively appoints me to the position, and gives me powers commensurate to the position, I don't see how I'm morally justified in interfering in another culture's internal behavior.

Might I deplore it personally, sure, but I'm a product of Western Morality. To me concepts like collective responsibility seem barbaric, punishing a family for the actions of one of it's members seems completely asinine to me. To people raised in a different culture the cult of the individual that we in the West espouse seems equally barbaric.

Basically, since I am a complete cultural relativist I do not think that interfering in the behavior of another culture is a right action. So like I said, chalk me up as an isolationist and let Pol Pot do whatever he wants to his own people as long as keeps his grubby mitts off my people. For that matter if Moteuctzoma was still around I'd say let him keep sacrificing humans to his gods too, also not my place to interfere with.

And if that makes me a bad person, whatever.

-abs

Chalk me up as in favor of "Captive Girl" for the win.

(Of course I do have to admit to some bias, I married the author.)

-abs

I'll note that Andrew Burt's qualifications for membership in SFWA have little to do with his qualifications to become President of SFWA.

The skills that a good writer make do not necessarily make for a good politician, nor for a knowledgeable techie, nor for many other professions.

Let's not confuse what it takes to manage SFWA and mistake it for the same skill-set it takes to join SFWA. Even if he wrote the bare minimum stories over 5 decades ago and hadn't even WANTED to write anything anymore he might be an excellent candidate for President of SFWA. (That he's not a good candidate is totally unrelated to how good or bad a writer he is.)

(And let's also try to keep the ad hominem attacks down too please. Just because we don't agree with him doesn't necessarily make him a bad person. Down that line of reasoning lie the crusades, the inquisition, and George W. Bush.)

-abs

@13

"If you can get past an irrational hatred for all things TSA, you might agree that this is a reasonable solution."

Firstly, I don't think most people's hatred of the TSA is irrational, most folk have perfectly good reasons to hate them that range from the personal, "they stole food for my baby", to the theoretical, "I hate unconstitutional extensions of power on the part of the government, and particularly the fear-mongering tactics used to enable such extensions."

Secondly, even the TSA itself has admitted to the impossibility of mixing liquid explosive pre-cursors on a plane.

So no, even if I didn't hate the TSA, or even if I did and it was rational, I don't think this is a "reasonable solution".

But frankly, I think you're just another shill for authoritarianism and I doubt you would disapprove of anything our government did, ever, if you'd been alive during the Revolutionary War I'll wager you'd have been a monarchist tory. Thanks for being a government apologist though, hopefully that biz works better for you on other sites. I don't think it's flying very well here.

-abs

@DCulberson
I think some of that conditioning is local, rather than a universal part of western culture. I know none of the guys I grew up with cared too much about urinal dividers, or peeing in the woods, or at a trough for that matter. In fact I learned how to pee my name into the snow by example. (a bad example perhaps, but I wasn't unusual)

For us it was mostly that we just didn't care. If someone went and stared that would certainly bother me now, and would've then as well. But if you weren't staring at someone's package then no one really cared too much.

But like I said, I think it's a regionalism. Or possibly this is an urban v. rural thing. Or maybe a socio-economic thing. But I'm pretty sure it's not a universal norm for western culture.

-abs

IM IN UR TUBES PRUVIN UR AL RONG!

-abs

I don't normally like Yoko. (Purely stupid reasons, I hate her voice as I find it grating.)

This is a refreshing reminder that just because I find someone annoying it doesn't mean they're a bad person.

In fact she seems to be a fine human being after all.

My bad.

Sorry Yoko. (but I still don't like your music, no offense, just not my thing.)

-abs

I find myself wondering why all the people who keep asserting that the kid deserved it because he should have respected the officer think that policemen (and women) deserve respect.

What makes a policeman a better person than someone else and thus deserving of more respect?

I don't think any of us, even the authoritarians, would assert that if someone called a random civilian on the street "dude" that civilian would then have the right to batter us.

Why do we think police deserve more than the rest of us?

Why soldiers? Why anyone?

I was a serviceman (US Navy) myself, and I can damn well tell you my fellow sailors weren't any more "worthy" of respect than anyone else. Hell, if anything we were worse than them. Sailors and soldiers are a rude, crude, rather violent bunch, AND WE LIKED IT THAT WAY.

Hell, I've been chewed out for "sirring" people, sergeants and master chiefs in particular don't like being called "sir". They work MUCH harder than any pansy-ass officer does.

The only circumstance I know of in the US that any of us would likely face where we are legally compelled to be respectful is when we're in court. Even there the judge can't assault you, he can merely inarcerate you.

-abs

@64

I tried to read your comment. But the style was so tortuous I only made it through about 25% before deciding that nothing you had to say was worth the effort and moving on to other commentors.

>QUOTE

RESPONSE

Really only works for a small number of quotes in my never humble opinion. If you need to respond to loads of people . . . well, post more often, or use a different format.

As for the original topic, yeah, America kinda blows chunks freedom-wise these days. Back in the day I defended it in the military, nowadays I'm just horrified at what's going on. Clearly Americans don't actually want freedom anymore, clearly we want safety. Otherwise we wouldn't put up with this crap.

-abs

@Rauz,

Not as much lutefisk and us Minnesotan Swedish descendants do.

*twitch* *shudder*

Give me lefse anyday. It doesn't tarnish spoons, and I've never seen a cat throw it right back up after eating it. (which I have seen w. lutefisk)

Lefse is also actually tasty, whereas lutefisk is practically the polar opposite of tasty.

Yigg.

*twitches some more at memories of lutefisk, painful memories*

-abs

I can't read this.

I can't even try.

Too, too sensitive, and far too close to life.

-abs

I don't recall hearing anything about that.

But from the overreaction by the airport police to a student with an LED-wired t-shirt at Logan Airport I believe we can say with certainty that the event doesn't seem to have affected behavior of the Boston police.

-abs
"God I hate my city sometimes, then I realize I could live in Texas, and I'm happy again."

I'm sorry Teresa, I'm with Euryale and Hassan on this one.

Although I agree Hassan could clearly have chosen to express his sentiment in a more eloquent, and hopefully less vulgar, manner I think his sentiment is spot on.

One does NOT chuck someone elses puppy into a pool to see if it can swim. While I agree he did the right thing in jumping in after it I'll have to admit that if he tossed my cat into a pool to see if it could swim I wouldn't care if jumped in to save it afterwards. I would still want to send to the hospital in an ambulance, though in the actual event I doubt I would since I'm a fairly non-violent sort.

But what he did was legitimately beyond the pale.

And yes, the puppy has consumed all of my attention. At this point I couldn't care less about anything else he's involved in. My outrage overwhelms all rational thought. Animal and child abuse tend to do that to me.

-abs

Whoops, guess my response got cut off.

I meant to finish it thusly.....

. . . that says "I

-abs

@Wynneth in #11

I absolutely LOVE that shirt. It's one of the favorites in my collection of black t-shirts.

I almost love it as much as the one that has one of those color-blindness test-circles (the ones with loads of different dots in them) that says "I

-abs

@Santa's Knee

I'm not trying to sell you on anything dude. If I'm dead in a post-apocaplytic world and you're hungry and nearby, go to town. I'm sure I'm tasty with some chianti and fava beans, and if you're actually starving I'm sure I'm tasty without them too.

Eat whomever you want.

I'll just decline to join you.

But it's a personal decision not an evangalistic exercise on my part. Do what you will, just don't try to make me do the same.

-abs

Vegetarianism is fine, in a luxury economy.

In a survival environment you eat what you can get, or you don't survive. That's what a survival environment means.

Eat what you can find, or stay vegetarian and starve. No difference to me. I plan on being dead in the event of an apocalypse.

I do have to disagree w. Santa's Knee though. There are definitely worse things than death. Like the Donner party indian guides I agree cannibalism is one. Perhaps for a vegetarian eating meat would be another, I know it wouldn't be one for me.

-abs

I smell a decrease in apparent DWBs and an increase in pulling over black drivers to "reward" them. Since both sorts of stops should result in roughly the same conviction rates I can't see how anyone could disapprove. {[(/sarcarm)]}

Yes, I'll grant for NE2D's sake that this could be incompetance, I'm putting my $.05 down in favor of malice.

I think it's clearly an attempt to allow the officers to continue to pull people over on no-cause while providing just enough judicial "cause" that anything they discover is admissable. In other words, just a way to pull someone over for DWB without having to fill out a stop form where the driver's race could be noted and patterns of racial harrassment validated.

-abs

Hi Nick,

Not sure if you're still reading this thread, sorry, didn't check in over the weekend.

What I'm saying is that if I were in Stalin's Russia before the purges began and someone said, "Sure, we could revolt and put Stalin out of power but the civil war could cost us 6 million people, but if we succeed in deposing him it might save 20 - 50 million lives" I'd sign up for that revolt in a heartbeat.

I'm also saying that if someone said, "Because we believe that slavery is evil, and we believe that secession from the United States is wrong, and we have been attacked at Fort Sumter, we will be going to war, but the cost in human lives could be terrible, possibly even incalculable" I would approve that war and I would go sign up with the Federal Army.

I would also have signed up for World War II, and approved of it, when the cause was stopping a crazy man committing genocide and bent on the conquest of much of the civilized world, even as a Russian I would've signed up and they lost most of the young men of military age that they had and then a chunk of the younger and older men as well.

Does that make me stark raving mad? Maybe.

But sometimes violence is justifiable. Usually it's not. The fact that I need to reach to find even three truly just wars shows that I don't think the vast majority of wars qualify. But there are times when I feel a body count in the millions is justifiable if the wrong that is to be righted is hideous enough.

And if the US became a true dictatorship and looked like it would be going through a Stalinist style purge, then yes, that would be enough.

Thank whatever gods you will that it doesn't look anywhere near that at the moment. (Personally I'll thank the Spaghetti Monster for it, but who knows what gods you would prefer) I dearly hope we never reach that stage, but if the US doesn't start voting soon and stops responding to fear tactics by those who believe in a unitary executive we could be headed in the direction that in 20-30 years could take us there. For now, political action and vigilance are the answer. But in Stalin's Russian . . . well, those weren't options any more than they were in Mao's China or Hitler's Germany.

Hopefully that clarifies my position. Whether or not it leaves you thinking I'm mad, or stark-raving mad, is another issue entirely. I am a veteran of the military and although I am personally a pacifist by nature I'm also quite willing to employ lethal force in self-defense or in a just enough cause.

Maybe that does make me a raving looney, but it's very human. We are a violent species, and denying that is just denying human nature.

-abs

For Cicada @35

At the moment. Nope, definitely not worth 6 million dead Americans. Not worth 6 million dead anybodies.

But that's based on the US as it stands right now. My statement could easily change.

For example: Estimates of the casualties Stalin inflicted on the Russian people during his reign of terror run from 20 million to as high as 50 million dead.

If I thought the US was in danger of putting a Stalin in power (and at the moment I do NOT think that) I'd sacrifice 6 million of us in a heartbeat to stop it. And before you ask, yes, I would happily take my place in that 6 million.

So sure, you're right, 6 million deaths don't justify a revolution over copyright laws, or even the current abuses of the War on Some Drugs, they wouldn't even be worth stopping the Iraq war. But you're also wrong, 6 million is a trivial price to pay if that's what it takes to save 20-50 million.

And for what it's worth, I'd sacrifice 6 million to stop a secession by slave-holding states too if that was happening today.

Did you have a point beyond trying to scare me into slavish agreement that revolution is never justified in the modern world with a high body count? Try harder.

-abs

Actually Noen, you make a good point about the NIE. I'd not thought of that when I made my statement about the auguries being bad. That is a very encouraging sign.

Alas, I think the trend towards greater government opaqueness is increasing and this is just an exception.

I'm also very discouraged that the Democrats who were largely given Congress in the most recent elections in order to try to change things the Executive has done have pretty much proven all they care about is preserving the increased Executive powers so that they can have them in '08 if they win.

I'll cross my fingers though. You are right the NIE is pretty encouraging. Though I am stumped as to why Bush didn't at least delay it, or alter his rhetoric about it. Makes me wonder what he has behind his back . . .. .

-abs

Let's all hope there's no need for a revolution.

Anyhow, let me know how your peaceful opposition works out. The current administration doesn't seem terribly impressed.

For now I'll go home and have a drink, vote in my elections, talk to my representatives, and hope something changes. The drink is for my expectation that nothing will change.

-abs

I will agree with Noen that we are not near the state where violence in the streets is an acceptable solution. But I must disagree about signs pointing to things improving, in fact I read the auguries as pointing towards things worsening. I hope Noen's right, and I'm wrong.

I will also second Noen in suggesting that we should vote more as a nation. While I have said that no dictator is going to leave power just because of a vote we are not, yet, living in a dictatorship. We're just heading towards one. I find it terribly frustrating when I try to convince my friends to vote and simply can't seem to get them to agree to it, even when they strongly disagree with our government or one of it's decisions. Just makes me weep, metaphorically.

I like Asimov, but like Heinlen he's a great science fiction author and a rather crappy political analyst. Violence has done a lot of good AND a lot of bad, probably more bad than good if history is allowed to be read into the court's proceedings. In the end violence is that last refuge of everyone, competant and incompetant alike. And sometimes that refuge should be used, WWII comes to mind, as does the American Civil War or the American Revolution, sometimes a violent solution is the right one.

The danger is in humanity's willingness to resort to violence when it isn't the right answer, a willingness that we've proved is ever so human time and time again. Lots of primates make war, it's just who we are, whether african chimp, baboon, or human. You can decry it, you can try to fight against it, but violence is in our nature.

-abs

I don't think it'll happen Elysian. Not even sure it could happen, mobs don't do well against Apache helicopters unless you arm them with weapons more powerful than rifles and handguns.

Nor am I suggesting we should revolt yet. Not only am I far too soft-hearted to be willing to deal with the responsibility for all that blood that advocating it would require, I also think it would be massively over-reacting given the current situation.

I just fear it could become inevitable if the US keeps going in the same direction it currently is.

Which I desperately hope it does not.

-abs

@14

Maybe a little violence aimed at the overthrow of a corrupt political order and a complacent public is what the US needs. It certainly would be in keeping with our best traditions.

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -Thomas Jefferson

Not sure I'm willing to see that blood run in the streets personally. But I don't see much changing without it. The direction we're headed in will pretty mandate it eventually, real dictators don't give up power because they're voted out, and while we don't have a real dictator yet we are heading that way.

Bread, Circuses, Emperors. Welfare, Football, President-for-life. I could see it happening.

-abs

@ 1 & 2.

There's nothing wrong with killing people. It's why you kill people that is important. Do it for the right reasons and it's noble, for the wrong ones hideous. If we hadn't killed people the Nazi's would still be in power over all of Europe, noble. If Hitler hadn't killed people we wouldn't have had to, hideous.

And having invoked Godwin's Law I now declare myself the loser of this discussion and will move on.

-abs

Virgil @16 has made the same connection I immediately made. This is remarkably like the early, strategic-phase, part of a game of Go.

Fun, but very easy once you make the connection.

-abs

Tom,

The tao that can be spoken is not the tao.

Quantum == Zen. (and zen is the bastard love-child of Taoism and Buddhism)

Mu.

-abs

Incredibly cool work.

It reminds me the of the pre-Cambrian life-forms that used to exist in the ocean, very cool, but very very "wrong" to eyes used to the way modern life looks.

-abs

Do these work on Debian? Not very good gifts for me otherwise.

-abs

I love the look of absolute awe-struck, worshipful, jealousy on Animal's face as he watches Buddy beat the living bejesus out of those drums.

And . .. the Muppets rocked!

-abs

*laughs* I told my wife Jen about these, and she said, "Stop! Don't buy them."

She got the first two at WisCon this past year, where she helps Deb run the Galley Ho table.

*rubs hands together and cackles* Now all I need do is test them out on my nephew this Thanksgiving! Muahahaha!

-abs

Thanks Ape Lad! That's wonderful news.

Gonna go bother the hell outta Amazon now!

Oh, and although they don't know it, my nephew and niece thank you too. (Given how gross-humor and subversive they sound my sister-in-law might curse me, but I promise to keep your name out of it. But in truth I jest, she'll love 'em too I bet.)

-abs

I realize this is intended to be read by a slightly older age group than my nephew, who turned 4 a few months ago. But the subject matter sounds appealing.

Does anyone who's read these think they might be suitable for me to sit down and read TO him? I very much enjoy telling him stories and if there's enough illustrations in the stories to keep his interest I think he would enjoy the stories themselves.

But if it's mostly prose with only an illustration every few pages then I'd probably have to put it off until he's a bit older. Which would be pity, from the descriptions I think he might love this stuff, and as his little sister gets older she might do well with a good female role model also.

-abs

Oh come on folks. Am I the only one here to see the obvious use for these????

1. Buy goggles.
2. Obtain red-cape.
3. Climb to high-altitude balloon.
4. BLOG!!!!!!!!!

Duh.

-abs

@#1

I always thought murder was defined as the killing of a human being, and furthermore the deliberate killing that being what differentiated it from manslaughter.

So I think you should have said "before killing them..."

Unless you're just being rhetorical. In which case I'll point out that it's very tasty murder, as my own rhetorical comment.

-abs

Our elected body is defending these entities because they approve of what they're doing. I agree entirely with Noen.

Both the Democrats and Republicans are clearly in favor of expanding executive power, even at the expense of the law and even the Constitution. The Republicans like it because they're in power now, the Democrats because they hope to be in the Executive next time around.

In this particular instance I'm sure the contributions of AT&T and other telcos has something to do with the Democrats abandoning their duties to check the other branches of our government.

But as a general principle I think they would approve of the Excecutive power-grab anyway. Look at what they have done when we've had a Democratic President for proof. Massive expansion of Executive power via the War-on-Some-Drugs at the expense of the other branches.

All par for the course in my opinion.

-absimiliard

I'm with Chevan. If I'm eating cereal at all it's gonna be Grapenuts. (Mmmmmm . . . . twigs and gravel . . . . tasty!)

And when I eat Rocks'n'twi. . . . I mean Grapenuts I want to see 'em swimming in milk. Butterfly, backstroke, even the Crawl is fine, but damnit, they'd better be swimming or I'm adding more milk.

-abs

(and they're better after they soften a bit anyway)

Cory @#2 for the win.

-abs

Mmmmmmmmm. Tasty fried potatoes. . . .. .

That picture makes me feel like I should be in a cat-macro . . . . "Oh Noes! Do not have! WANT!!!!"

And for you carb-avoiding people, how can you live without pasta or potatoes?

-andy benson